On Immigration: backlash, racism, and the oblivious
Via the lovely and talented Claire:
A surge by the conservative candidate in Mexico’s 2006 presidential race has prompted rampant speculation that top U.S. political strategist Dick Morris may be advising his campaign.
…
Meanwhile, as most of the U.S. press remained oblivious, Morris used his column in the New York Post to point out the dangers of a possible Mexico-Venezuela-Cuba alliance.
“Remained oblivious”–what a colossal understatement. This isn’t new information. From January:
The foreign-policy implications of a fence are harder to handle. Already Latin resentment against the United States is fueling the rise of an oil- and cocaine-based leftist oligarchy throughout our hemisphere. Castro now has friends in power in Venezuela and Bolivia and moderate allies in Brazil, Uruguay and Argentina. In Peru, a leftist Chavez look-alike, Ollanta Humala, is leading in the presidential race. In Nicaragua, Daniel Ortega may be heading back to power by a gradual military coup. And in Mexico itself, a Chavez protégé, Andrés Manuel López Obrador, is leading in the polls for the July 2006 presidential race. Can you imagine having a border with a Chavez or a Castro, whose ability to disregard American concerns would be underscored by massive oil reserves?
Note that Morris DOES favor a fence, as do I. However, “nativists,” as he calls the proponents of more extreme “solutions,” may be doing more damage than good. Here’s more, from a column in April:
Lopez Obrador has attacked U.S. attempts to restrict Mexican immigration and will benefit tremendously if Congress alienates the Mexican electorate. A recent survey by John Zogby found that two-thirds of Mexicans feel Americans are racist and biased against them. A harsh shift in U.S. immigration policies could fuel a leftist victory in Mexico.
Mexicans are deeply offended by the idea of a wall designed to keep them out. Building a wall on the border without also starting a guest-worker program will play badly in Mexico. A wall with a guest-worker program might go down better, particularly if the legislation didn’t include punitive provisions making illegal immigration a felony.
I can’t say I blame Mexicans for thinking Americans are racist towards them. Just look around various blogs’ comments–you see things like “wetbacks” and other revolting (and embarrassing!) euphemisms. And anyone who doesn’t think calling Bush “El Presidente Jorge Arbusto” and the like smacks of the rhetoric of a racist is just willfully blind. And these people call themselves “conservatives,” which infuriates me. How DARE they appropriate a word I use for myself. We ostracize our racists and loons, and I won’t associate with any of the new breed of racists and loons. I’m sure even Tom Tancredo doesn’t want to be tarnished with the reputation of some of his advocates, either.
And then we get some of these people whining about being called racists. Well, tough shi’ite. Look around–the people who agree with some of you ARE racists. Expel them from your midst–they don’t deserve a voice in the matter, and they don’t help your cause. I have come to the point where I won’t even read any more immigration posts on certain blogs any more because of the cesspool that exists in comments–and sometimes in the posts themselves (I will never link to them–they don’t deserve it).
So guess what–if I were Mexican, or a Mexican American, or any kind of Hispanic, yeah, I’d say they have every reason to think that “we” are racists. Andrés Manuel López Obrador and all others like him have EVERY reason to capitalize on that, and capitalize they do. (Look at La Raza, right here in the US.)
Thanks a lot for helping those villains out, y’all. And thanks a lot for calling yourselves “conservatives,” like that excrable bigot Pat Buchanan does.
BTW, any and all comments at this blog that I think are racist will be farking nuked. If yours is, take the hint. You will be called out for it. Go ahead, take your widdle mawbles and go home, children.
I’d like to thank a couple wonderful people for remaining far above the idiocy despite their surroundings: Lorie Byrd and DJ Drummond at Polipundit.com. If you haven’t been there lately, go over and you’ll see what I mean.
More stuff to see:
Claire’s pictures from the May 1 protests
Dick Morris column archive
John Podhoretz: A Final Word for Now (re: immigration)
The Anchoress - she’s sick of the idiocy in the blogosphere lately, too. (True to character, she’s not as bile-spitting about it as I am. I am enraged beyond description, and desperately trying to remain civilized about it.)
What would Reagan do?
Tags: immigration, Mexico, Mexican elections, Dick Morris, Andrés Manuel López Obrador, Obrador, Vicente Fox, Hugo Chavez, leftists, the border, racism, racists, conservative apostasy, fever swamps, stupid blogosphere, WWRD, useful idiots, stupid “conservatives”
Martin says:
It’s true. Our side has gone farking NUTSO.
It’s appalling.
tommy says:
I thought you were through with this topic. I thought I was too. ;-) One last comment. (Even if you bring it up, I’m through with it from here on out.)
Look Beth, I get your message. So does anybody else who has read your comments: vote Republican. You make some valid points and I see why you feel that way. In fact, you’ve convinced me to hang in there a while longer.
But honestly, this “blame everything on the racists” approach you seem to be pursuing is something I would expect out of hard leftist, not out of a principled conservative. I don’t approve of racial slurs anymore than you do. I think they speak volumes about the people who use them and say little about the people they are aimed at.
Still, the problems caused by immigration are not going away even if everybody stops using the term “wetback”. The crime isn’t going away, the poor educational performance isn’t going away, the drain on the medical system isn’t going away. That isn’t an excuse for bad behavior, but it is a national reality.
I hope you’ll take a brief moment and look at this post from ParaPundit. I don’t necessarily agree with everything he writes, but the figures he cites for educational achievement for Americans of Mexican descent is startling. Even 4th generation Mexican-Americans are performing extremely poorly. This generation of Mexicans still has over a 40% dropout rate and less than 10% earn a post-high school degree. By the 4th generation, assimilation should no longer be an issue. Still, with our current approach of allowing unrestricted immigration we are, as a nation, “slouching towards Guadalajara”
http://www.parapundit.com/archives/001952.html
The latest figures for nationwide dropout rates among all Hispanics are 53%. A study in California recently found that even among those Hispanics who made made it to the 12th grade only were as knowledgeable as their white peers were in the 8th grade. (California, unsurprisingly, is reportedly lowering its educational standards in response.)
We need to do something about the Hispanics that are already here. We need to give them a chance to succeed. Our current approach isn’t working. Further illegal immigration isn’t going to help us, either. The U.S., in this day and age, has to maintain a competitive edge worldwide. This isn’t 1880 any longer, we are not expanding westward anymore. We cannot become a nation of high school dropouts and expect to be a world power. We cannot remain a First World country with a nation of landscapers, fruit vendors, or custodial workers — even if they do work very hard.
I hope you’ll give it further thought. :-)
Beth says:
What’s not principled about calling things as I see them? And how are words like “wetback” and some of the other shi’ite I see “principled conservatism?”
I shouldn’t blame things on racists? I don’t think you really mean that, or at least I hope you don’t. The truth is, many of these people ARE showing their true racist colors. I don’t like it. That’s not “leftist,”–wtf is that about?
Why would you even imply that?
Principled conservatives disassociate with racists. If you don’t agree with me on that, then I don’t mind if you think I’m not a “principled conservative.”
Did you read what was said about Mexicans (in Mexico) believing Americans are racists? Do you not BELIEVE that Obrador is using that to his advantage? Do you think that having a Chavez clone on our border is nothing to be worried about?
I hope you will give it further thought.
Diva says:
Great post Beth. I am disgusted by the crazy talk of impeachment, of idiots (that’s what they are)not going to vote to teach the Republican party a lesson and of the reactionary morons who think it’s all President Bush’s fault. Never once did I see the democrats or liberals break from the party after all the crap Clinton and Carter pulled. What kind of self-loathing moron exists that would prefer to have democrats in power just to send a message to the republicans? I just don’t get it. The democrats Carter and Clinton are partially if not mainly responsible for the USA’s problems with terrorism because of their appeasement and moral relativist approach to the problem. God help us if we a democrat (specially a left wing loon) ever has the power of the presidency because we can all kiss our behinds good-bye.
Now I need to chase down a dozen Pepcid AC tablets down with a bottle of Mylanta for this ulcer - which I previously had blamed on the unhinged Left wing of the democratic party, now I can add some of the raving mad elements of the Republican party for my burning ulcer.
tommy says:
That’s not “leftist,”–wtf is that about?
Why would you even imply that?
Beth, what I am saying is that you are completely focused on the use of a few admittedly regrettable slurs used by a few total losers while ignoring larger issues. Like most people who don’t hold a strong opinion on the immigration issue, you seem to not be too concerned about the problems our society is facing because of unrestrained immigration. Too many people in our society seem to want to pretend the problems don’t exist. The fact that a few ignorant people throw the term “wetback” around seems to mean a lot more to you than the fact that thousands of our citizens every year are murdered at the hands of illegals, for instance. That is the sort of thing I expect from a loony leftist, not from a rational conservative. You seem pretty down-to-earth in most issues; I don’t understand your position on this one.
Beth, do you remember when the Mexicans were screaming “Osama, Osama, Osama” at the soccer stadium a few years back? Most Mexicans still believe that the Southwest was “stolen” from them. (Forget the Treaty of Guadeloupe, they don’t care.) Polls back from a few years ago showed that most people in Mexico consider the U.S. to be an “enemy” of Mexico. All of these things were going on before the immigration debate really heated up here in America over the last year or so. The only way they are going to consider us “non-racists” is if we completely open up our southern border to let anybody and everybody in. I’m not prepared to do that. So if the Mexicans want to continue feeling we are all a bunch of racists, then so be it. You know as well as anybody how the Left and Co. (Islamists, Hispano-Communists, and so forth) likes to throw terms like ‘racist’, ‘islamophobe’, ‘bigot’, ‘eurocentric’, ‘imperialist’, ‘fascist’, etc. around at their enemies, regardless of how irrational these smears might be. I’m not willing to stand by and permanently surrender my country further to the Aztlan loonies and Hispano-Commies in a vain attempt to prevent Hispanics from going socialist in the next election.
I am going to copy a comment posted on the Minutemen blog that appeared a few days ago from a Hispanic immigrant (legal with a green card) who went by the moniker “your mom”:
don’t know where you all got the idea, but Mexicans are not trying to take over this country. We are here to live, eat, breathe…(things you also do…i hope). As I’ve said before, I am proud to be Mexican, I was born there, I am proud of my culture it is beautiful and rich. I do not wish to take anybody’s job…I pay taxes…i do not wish to harm anybody and I get along with people of all colors just fine thankyouverymuch. I can see that not ALL of you are racist…but let’s be honest…there’s been quite a large number of hateful remarks towards “the foreigners” on this site. I can understand why Pedro and Victoria would want to fight back when their ancestors are being called criminals…by they way…I’ve read their blogs and your responses and why would you think they could be sent back to Mexico? They were born here…therefore they are US citizens. I, on the other hand am not.
My cousins make fun of me and call me a “gringa” because I now speak more English than I do Spanish…and you know what…that is pretty embarassing…I should be able to speak both languages equally well. Assimilation is such an ugly word-why should we ALL be the same? Isn’t that what makes America such a great country? The variety of its people, the different cultures? To demand that there only be one culture is insane….that to me sounds like genocide…
Now, I am a teacher as well and I have had the experience of working with students who speak English as a second language (much like I was when I first moved here when I was ten) and I have seen that children, and their parents have different abilities in learning. As you get older your ability to learn a new language is incredibly decreased. That is why you had trouble understanding the lady who was cutting your hair the other day…hey at least she TRIED to speak english…did you try speaking to her in Spanish…I didn’t think so….
Why shouldn’t your kids learn how to speak Spanish? There are a lot more Spanish speaking countries in the world than any other language, yet English is the most widely spoken world-wide. Speaking as an immigrant-I never once even hoped that anyone would be able to understand me when speaking spanish….and when I find people who do I jump at the chance of practicing my native tongue. Is that wrong? Is it wrong that I want to teach my children how to speak spanish?
What if I said that it was French? (like in Quebec where they speak two languages)…The more languages we speak as people the better…why should there only be ONE…Children in Europe learn how to speak five languages…I figure they’re probably a lot smarter than us because they can communicate with people of many different countries…
As far as the bill goes…I completely disagree with articles 1, four and five. Why should people have to completely reject their place of origin…if you are American and you move to any other country…you are not demanded to give up your right to vote in the elections of your native country (at least I know this is true in Mexico). So what if people carry the flags of their native countries…That doesn’t mean that their allegiance is only to that country. I have a flag of Brazil that I received as a gift at World Youth Day and I there is Brazilian about me. Don’t you think its a little harsh to be deported once you’ve become naturalized just because you are proud of where you were born? (think about it this way…you are working in a foreign country-they are paying you 1,000,000 for your work (i’m just exxaggerating of course) and you are proud of being American (right?) so you don’t want to give up that money…and you continue working in this country for years…In about 5 years you become a citizen of that country…then two years later they pass this law where you can’t be proud of your country of origin…because if you are then you will be considered a traitor and sent back….
Doesn’t that sound a little harsh?
Let’s just assume that people aren’t ALL terrorists…because they are NOT…no matter what some of you might think…just because you jump over the river does not make you a terrorist-criminal ok-you broke 1 law.
why should all pamphlets be in English? What about visitors from other countries….The whole world doesn’t speak English…It is just presumptous to assume that everyone should.
If you can’t see that this bill does indeed discriminate against all foreigners-and not only Mexican people-then you must be blind.
In response to ‘Minutemen Blog’ post: http://minutemanhq.com/b2/index.php/national/2006/05/10/p624
Tell me, do you want a nation with millions more people like this lady? Is this what you would consider a patriotic American? Can you see the entitlement mentality and the contempt for our culture, our laws, and our society implicit in her remarks. I’m not claiming all immigrants are like this, not by a long shot, but far too many are for my comfort.
I responded to your post because you asked a bunch of question. I’ve tried to state my position as best I can. I will assume any further questions from you are figures of speech (I ask rhetorical questions all the time, so I’m not harping on you, by any means, either). I’m sick debating the issue. Maybe you are too. Have a nice day. :-)
Apollyon says:
John Zogby found that two-thirds of Mexicans feel Americans are racist and biased against them. A harsh shift in U.S. immigration policies could fuel a leftist victory in Mexico.
I for one could care less what the Mexicans think of us. Just like I could care less what the islamofascists think of us. We have allowed Mexicans and many latinos to break our immigration laws with impunity, we give them free medical and educate their children at taxpayer expense, they get welfare, use fake social security numbers, receive section 8 housing and so on. And I’m supposed to feel guilty for this while being labeled a racist?? They can go f*%k themselves. It took me 4 years to LEGALLY enter the US from the USSR and the Mexicans need to follow US immigration laws just like everyone else on the globe.
I can’t say I blame Mexicans for thinking Americans are racist towards them. Just look around various blogs’ comments–you see things like “wetbacks” and other revolting (and embarrassing!) euphemisms. And anyone who doesn’t think calling Bush “El Presidente Jorge Arbusto” and the like smacks of the rhetoric of a racist is just willfully blind.
Again, the Mexicans can take their cries of racism and shove it. Although I don’t use the term “wetback” I have no problem with it. Just like
I have no problem with the word “redneck”. Both originated under similar circumstances. It’s funny how I hear no complaints about words like gringo or redneck but God forbid you say wetback, then you’re a knuckle-dragging racist. I call bullsh!t…….I refer to out Head Sombrero as El President Bushi’iteo and if you think that’s racism then you have thin skin. If El Bushi’iteo were repeatedly licking Putin’s boots like he is Verminte Fox’s then I would be calling Bushi’iteo Comrade and other Russian terms I’d come up with. If this is what passes as racism these days then we’ve really been lobotomized by the liberal PC nazis.
And then we get some of these people whining about being called racists. Well, tough shi’ite. Look around–the people who agree with some of you ARE racists.
Again, I could care less if someone calls me a racist. The term has lost it’s meaning; just as the term “nazi” has lost some of it’s meaning with the flippant way libturds throw it around.
BTW, any and all comments at this blog that I think are racist will be farking nuked.
For someone who posts at The Anti-Idiotarian Rottweiler (and for what it’s worth I enjoy your posts there) where no dissenting view gets deleted it does seem pretty childish for you to threaten to remove any post that deviates from your view. But it’s your blog.
Delete away oh tolerant ones.
gnadfly says:
I work with Mexican-Americans at my regular IT job and am in a side business with a Mexican-American both here in Houston, TX.
Having worked and played with them and travelled to the TX/MX and CA/MX border frequently I have to say its hard to generalize about Mexican immigration. The educated Tex/Mex understands some of the biasness towards Hispanic people and will often joke about it. Most that I’ve talked to do not favor opening the borders, especially if they got here legally.
For some reason here in Texas the non-Hispanic community is not up in arms about illegal MX immigration though. Its not looked at as a huge social burden but rather just a cost of doing business. Sure you get the occassional person who is against teaching Spanish in public school but its hard to complain too much when they are mowing your lawns, fixing your roof and cooking your food in most of the local restaraunts.
gnadfly says:
BTW, nice website redesign.
Lorie Byrd says:
Thanks Beth! The support is much appreciated.
Vinnie says:
What would Reagan do?
Grant amnesty, re: 1986.
Apollyon says:
Sure you get the occassional person who is against teaching Spanish in public school but its hard to complain too much when they are mowing your lawns, fixing your roof and cooking your food in most of the local restaraunts.
Teaching Spanish as one of the many courses is all right but once you’re teaching every subject in Spanish then you’ve got a serious problem. Just because we have many latinos in this country doesn’t mean we should deprive the kids of learning English, the language of this country. Why should we set up a different set of rules for a particular group? Immigrants who come here legally want to assimilate and unfortunately many latinos have no interest in assimilating; they just want to use America as an employment entity while remaining balkanized. Unfortunately many of us have allowed this to develop and we will soon be facing the same problems that France has with its balkanized Muslim community that refuses to assimilate. I live in Los Angeles and have many Mexican, Salvadorian, Guatemalan friends. They echo my sentiments and are disgusted at how their brethren use this country while having absolutely no allegiance to it. What Mexicans need to do is reform their own corrupt country instead of looking to America and Americans to take care of them. Of course this is precisely what the PRI and Verminte Fox want; to export their poor instead of addressing their own massive internal problems while we take care of their citizens and provide everything Mexico refuses to. We’ve created a form of 21st century slavery because we want cheap workers and unfortunately there are many excusing this abominable practice that exploits the downtrodden Mexican’s/latinos. We’ve become so damn lazy that we can’t mow our own lawns, we want cheap home renovation, we want cheap cooks, we want cheap roofers, etc…I guess it’s ok to exploit these people as long as we get cheap services. The reality is it’s not cheap. Illegal immigrants are now costing the US taxpayer approx $500 BILLION a year. This is how myopic many Americans are; they don’t see the ramifications of what’s happening.
Beth says:
Just so y’all know, I’m not for amnesty. My position is, and has been:
1) secure the borders first, INCLUDING the Canadian border
2) guest worker program, after the borders are secure.
GNADFLY: Well said, and I agree with you 100%.
JohnDewey says:
Beth,
I’m all for securing our borders. Let’s use electronic surveillance and hire 5,000 more border agents. But let’s not try to build a fence across a 2,000 mile wilderness.
A border fence would just waste billions. The first 20 tunnels will be solidly in place before the fence is half finished. Our governments will spend thousands of hours annually repairing gaps in fences that appear with each daybreak. Someone will work many more hours collecting and burning all the makeshift ladders.
I also object to the environmental impact of a fence or wall. Though hardly a tree-hugger, I do appreciate the fragility of desert wildlife. Restricting the hunting and migratory patterns of Mexican jaguars, desert antelope, and javelinas just cannot be part of a border solution. There’s got to be a better way.